In this episode of Consulting Spotlight, Michael Bernzweig interviews Ali Hafizji, founder of Wednesday Solutions, a professional services agency specializing in AI-driven product engineering. They discuss the journey from MVP to market fit, innovative business models, the role of founders in scaling businesses, and the importance of building effective teams. Ali shares insights on the differences between B2B and B2C strategies, the consultative approach to product strategy, and common challenges faced by founders. The conversation highlights the significance of focusing on meaningful metrics and the impact of effective consulting on business growth.
In this episode of Consulting Spotlight, Michael Bernzweig interviews Ali Hafizji, founder of Wednesday Solutions, a professional services agency specializing in AI-driven product engineering. They discuss the journey from MVP to market fit, innovative business models, the role of founders in scaling businesses, and the importance of building effective teams. Ali shares insights on the differences between B2B and B2C strategies, the consultative approach to product strategy, and common challenges faced by founders. The conversation highlights the significance of focusing on meaningful metrics and the impact of effective consulting on business growth.
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Michael Bernzweig (00:02.53)
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I'd like to welcome everyone to this week's edition of the Consulting Spotlight. My name is Michael Bernzweig, I am your host and the founder of Software Oasis. This week we're joined by Ali Hafizji He's the founder of Wednesday Solutions. And with that, Ali, welcome to the Consulting Spotlight.
Ali Hafizji (00:28.574)
Thanks for having me, Michael. It's a pleasure to be here.
Michael Bernzweig (00:31.456)
Yeah, no, very excited to have you with us. And I can see from some of the questions that came in from the community that a lot of people are excited to hear about our topic today. for anyone that may not be familiar with either yourself or with Wednesday Solutions, can you give us a little bit of your backstory getting to where you are and what Wednesday Solutions provides for a
solution to SaaS founders.
Ali Hafizji (01:04.141)
Sure, so my name is Ali. I'm one of the founders at Wednesday. I'm an engineer by education, but a business owner by choice. I've pretty much built digital businesses all my life. Currently at Wednesday, we are an agency, a professional services agency that specializes in AI driven product engineering. Just a little bit of a backstory. So before I started Wednesday, I used to run a product venture.
The story with that company was that me and my co-founder, built out the MVP. We figured out a few paying customers amongst ourselves, people that we knew, and we even raised a small round of investment. And once you raise money, you have growth targets and metrics that you need to meet. And what we realized early on as founders was that we couldn't really meet those growth metrics or targets unless and until we changed what we were doing.
So what we were doing until then was we were heads down, trying to design the product, do the engineering, do all of that stuff. But at that inflection point, at that turning point, we needed to change. We needed to change what we were doing. We needed to start talking to customers, start looking at how they were using the product, how they're living life without it. We needed to focus on marketing, distribution, sales, fundraising, and all of that stuff.
but we needed a team that could actually build the product just the way that we would. And fast forward to now, what we're doing with Wednesday is we are sort of building teams of these elite AI, like sort of AI native engineers and designers that help founders sort of take care of product strategy, design and engineering. I think that teams are primarily one of the core reasons that either like I think core...
values or systems that one needs to have in place for success. In fact, the business that I was running before Wednesday, I think one of the reasons why it didn't work out was that we didn't really invest as much time as we should have in building that team out.
Michael Bernzweig (03:13.834)
Interesting. And I think, you know, for a lot of founders, you know, the early focus in any new SaaS solution is finding that product market fit and getting to the point where you have something that you've iterated to the point where you've got your MVP, the market, you have some initial customers using the solution, you've started to refine things. But I think
you get to that point where it's time to scale and maybe even bring on some early funding or maybe even a little.
Ali Hafizji (03:47.918)
Mm-hmm.
Michael Bernzweig (03:56.268)
later on if things are really looking good, going from that angel funding to some VC funding or other types of funding to scale things. Each one of those points along the journey is different. Can you describe the solution or the service that you're specifically providing to founders? What is it that you're helping them with?
Ali Hafizji (04:23.404)
Yeah, so I think every founder has a, like the core desire that every founder has is to sort of build a really big business. So the way that we, the service is called Launch and Launch is the sort of meant to help a founder move from MVP to PMF. And if you look at what other agencies are doing, what they're doing is they're primarily sort of billing.
their customers on a time and material basis. What that means is you're basically paying an hourly fee. What we are doing is we're changing that business model a bit and we're saying that, what's the smallest outcome that we can provide as an agency to a customer? And in the software development world, it's a sprint. So our pricing is actually based on a sprint. So we charge per sprint. That means
Michael Bernzweig (05:14.103)
Okay.
Ali Hafizji (05:20.684)
we're going to decide what needs to get done at the start of the sprint and in two weeks actually deliver it. This means that if I take more than two weeks to deliver it, the customer still pays me the same. So there's sort of skin in the game and we are talking in terms of outcomes and not in terms of time anymore. So if you think about it from the customer's perspective, what founders really need at the early stage is
Michael Bernzweig (05:24.866)
Right.
Michael Bernzweig (05:45.54)
you
Ali Hafizji (05:48.75)
a team that can actually deliver what they promise and a team that can actually move a business metric. And that metric may be anything early on. Let's say they're targeting acquisition or retention or referrals or revenue. And to actually move that metric, you may need to identify and build certain features. With this model, what you do is you only pay if those features are built and you're not really paying on a time and material basis.
Michael Bernzweig (06:07.95)
Sure.
Ali Hafizji (06:17.526)
This allows for a few things to happen for the founder. So number one is because we're using so much AI in our entire process, right from design, development, testing, launch, distribution, et cetera, we can do more per sprint. We can also do it with less a number of people. So there's less sort of overhead in terms of communication. There's less.
Michael Bernzweig (06:21.281)
Okay.
Ali Hafizji (06:45.832)
There's more happening per sprint and you get more iterations. So because we sort of charge per sprint and not on time, you get more hits on the target because every sprint is a release. And I've never really met a smart founder who didn't make it if he had more hits. So we're really allowing founders to get more hits at the target.
Michael Bernzweig (06:48.47)
and
Michael Bernzweig (07:04.621)
So.
Michael Bernzweig (07:08.884)
So it sounds like at the point where you're jumping in and helping a founder out, their role is shifting from that initial, you know, role of finding the product market fed and that initial role of helping organizations to, to get, get to market. And now you're actually.
helping them with the development. And so it's almost like they're handing the baton over in terms of the product end of what they're doing and they're moving into other roles. They're freeing up their time for other things that are important to the business at that stage.
Ali Hafizji (07:53.13)
Exactly. that's exactly what I was talking about before, is that just one second, Michael. So I think what matters, sorry.
Michael Bernzweig (08:05.358)
Sure.
Ali Hafizji (08:15.592)
Yeah, so sorry about that. So I think that that's what I was talking about before is that the minute you reach MVP, I think it's like a developmental milestone. So just like, you know, a child needs to do a few things as they, you know, hit six months of age and eight months of age and nine months of age in a year. Similarly, a founder needs to change their role. They need to start doing things very, very differently. So we allow them the freedom to do that.
Michael Bernzweig (08:24.472)
Maria?
Michael Bernzweig (08:34.403)
Right?
Ali Hafizji (08:44.172)
without having to worry about, know, is, it going to be built just the same way if I were to do it? And because the business model is structured to have skill in the game, it sort of builds trust.
Michael Bernzweig (08:58.98)
So it obviously, and there's so many constraints on the founder as they're growing an organization that it absolutely, you know, maybe the best use of their time and skills, of course they can do everything, but maybe the best use of their skills early on is getting their idea and their MVP to market and getting things working and finding that product market fit. then...
Ali Hafizji (09:06.008)
Yeah.
Michael Bernzweig (09:24.036)
at one point in the evolution, need to step into some other roles and manage at a higher level. And it sounds like you're allowing them to do that. So other than the actual technical sprints and the development, there other areas that you're helping founders with and kind of guiding them along their journey with?
Ali Hafizji (09:49.068)
Yeah, so I think.
We're doing a bunch of things. So for example, a sprint isn't really just software engineering or design and development. It's much more than that for us. So a sprint is about delivering a business outcome. Just give me one.
Michael Bernzweig (10:10.532)
Sure.
Ali Hafizji (10:26.414)
Okay, that shouldn't happen again. So yeah, I think so. So founders need to, okay. So I think a sprint is not just delivering an incremental piece of software. For us, a sprint is far more than that. So we take a very consultative approach and we try and help the founders just through different activities where we look at the data.
Michael Bernzweig (10:44.216)
Right?
Ali Hafizji (10:55.502)
They look at the stage of business they're at. Maybe the founder needs to raise another round of funding and what's most important for them at that point in time. Let's say they're a B2C product and they really need to get their retention metric in place. So for example, if you're a B2C product, you need to ensure that every release that you make at the one month mark, you need to have retention of at least 15%. So 15 % of users need to keep coming back to the app.
Michael Bernzweig (11:04.963)
Yeah.
Michael Bernzweig (11:22.498)
Yeah, so helping them with churn, right? It is a big, big area.
Ali Hafizji (11:25.634)
Correct. So we need to, we need to sort of identify what's the most important metric for them at that stage in the business. And if you're a B2B product, you need to ensure that, you know, retention is at least 20%. How do you, how do you get them to refer different businesses to use the same product? We need to identify what's most important and then strategize along with them as to what they need to do. So we don't just do the implementation, but we also figure out, you know, what is the
What is the product roadmap like? What are the different features that need to be built? At what priority they need to be built at? Why do we need to build something now? How does this help the business, et cetera?
Michael Bernzweig (12:06.208)
And I want to leave the audience with the correct perspective. know prior to recording, we talked for a few minutes a little bit more about your organization, but...
for anyone that's listening to the episode, you know, they may have heard the whole AI word and for sure AI definitely helps with iterating and development, but it sounds like there is a pretty substantial team behind the scenes with a lot of different areas of expertise and a lot of different individuals working on each of these engagements. Can you?
Tell me a little bit more about the team and the size and the types of roles that are involved.
Ali Hafizji (12:52.846)
So it depends on the client, but what I'm seeing happen most often for, you know, both B2B and B2C businesses, it doesn't really change, is you want an equal number of people thinking and doing, which means that at least what we're seeing is we need to at least include a product manager, you know, two designer, like one designer, one product designer, and then two engineers. That's what we're seeing work really well.
But together as a team, they need to think and ideate what needs to be built, why it needs to be built. Everybody has ideas, questions. They need to look at the data together. And that's when you can really identify what to build and how to build well. So we want the team to not just do tasks, but we also want them to think about what to do and do it well.
We're seeing this combination work well in a team. But I think that if there is a product and we've seen this happen before, let's say they're building multiple products together, they may be building a couple of freemium tools along with the core product, we see teams of slightly bigger sizes as well.
Ali Hafizji (14:20.142)
You're on mute.
Michael Bernzweig (14:20.526)
Got it, okay. And then more specifically, Ali, your team, you know, that would be working on your Wednesday team that would be working on these projects, can you share a little bit more about the team and the size and the skill set and all of that?
Ali Hafizji (14:38.638)
Yeah, we're about 60 people strong now and we've had the privilege of working with over 50 founders and we've helped them through their MVP to PMF journey. Many of them have found PMF and in fact raised further rounds of funding. The team is most of the, I mean, most of the core team that I've got with me has been working with me since my previous startup. So, you know, we work well together. And then the remaining team around these guys
has been sort of hired, handpicked, and sort of gone through a sort of training and development program that we've designed that makes sure that they're not really thinking in tasks, they're thinking about strategy, they're thinking about how to use different AI tools, and the whole gamut, right? So we're not really creating teams on the fly. We ensure that everybody goes through a certain program after which they are added.
to a client project, which is why we're so picky about who we work with.
Michael Bernzweig (15:43.0)
Yeah, and I think that's an important component to any business. think, let's face it, in the early days of any business, any client is one more client than you have. But as you start to zero in on which organizations you can make the most impact for and which organizations are the best fit for your organization, I think that's...
Ali Hafizji (15:48.387)
Yeah.
Michael Bernzweig (16:09.604)
you know, a different level of maturity within a business. you know, at the end of the day, you can obviously choose to be a bit more selective and, uh, you know, work with the clients where you're able to help move the needle the most. Now, are some of the, you mentioned B2B, you mentioned B2C. Um, the majority of our audience is in the B2B space. So maybe we can kind of focus a little more on that, but.
Ali Hafizji (16:19.438)
Thank you.
Michael Bernzweig (16:39.138)
Do you find big differences between the two segments other than churn?
Ali Hafizji (16:49.098)
I think there's a, yeah, there are large differences. So the way that we even consult with them is slightly differently. So for example, for a B2B business, many a times we may, especially for early stage founders or first time founders where they may have never really taken a product to market, we may sort of consult with them to identify what are the best channels to really market that product. And sometimes it's like a founder
a founder content led approach where you sort of focus on creating the founder profile rather than doing traditional ads, for example. And we're not going to do the work for them, but we'll just sort of consult with them and try and help them think through among all the different options that are available, what should they pick? Many times if it's a B2B product or it's not really customer facing, nobody's going to use it, let's say it's an SDK or an API or some kind of middleware.
we would sort of work with them to identify what's the right partnership route. Again, in a consulting fashion, we're not going to implement it for them. The same will be very different for a B2C business where they might take a more sort of traditional ad-based approach or an influencer led model. And they lead to very different use cases for the product as well, because you're going to get a sort of customer coming in through that flow where they're aware about your service or product through
So a very different means. for example, if it's through an Instagram ad, the person using the product may not be so patient. So you need to be able to deliver value very quickly. Whereas if it's like through a B2B route, let's say somebody looks at an offering on a newsletter, they may be fairly patient and they may be willing to fill out, let's say a two page KYC form, for example. So one needs to look at the entire user journey.
And these play a very important role in the way that you actually design and build out, let's say, the onboarding journey.
Michael Bernzweig (18:54.86)
Makes a lot of sense, makes a lot of sense. And do you find more of your clients are in one space versus the other, or is it pretty well split or?
Ali Hafizji (19:05.259)
We find a lot of customers in health tech, fintech. We've done a bunch of things in marketplaces, but I think health tech and fintech have been common, not because we've sort of done anything. I think it's just my previous startup was a fintech company and I knew people in that area and then that sort of compounded. And health tech just happened organically to us, but we've done majority of our work there. would say about 70%.
Michael Bernzweig (19:32.206)
Got it. and it sounds like, you know, at the end of the day, for a lot of the organizations you're working with, having had such a diverse range of clients makes you stronger in terms of being able to provide some deep insights in different areas. So I guess another question, you know, when you think about it, you know, as an organization is moving through the different stages of,
you know, after having their MVP to the point where it's working and they're growing. Are there different types of advisory services that you provide? mean, are you providing introductions to specific organizations? Are you helping them sort out, you know, what the next steps are and then handing the baton to them to...
figure things out or how much of a role are you playing in these next steps?
Ali Hafizji (20:34.798)
So we take it on a case by case basis. We don't really offer any advisory services on top of what we do with launch because we feel like our core expertise is in product development and strategy. And that's what we want to sort of focus on. But we've done a bunch of things where we've done introductions to investors. We've played the role with many non-tech founders. We've played the role of the acting CTO and we've represented the company.
know, investor meetings or partnership meetings, et cetera. We've also done, many of them wanted like at a certain stage want to hire their first, you know, engineer, let's say a tech role. And we've helped them, you know, find the right candidate as well. So these are some of the different roles of services that we've provided, but we don't, take it on a case by case basis. You know, we don't really charge separate for these things. It's just, if it helps the customer, if it helps, helps them move a needle.
to metric we'll just sort of do it for them.
Michael Bernzweig (21:37.454)
Sure. And then the other question, because I think this is a big one for a lot of founders. So after, you you have the sprints, you get them situated, they're up and running, you know, maybe they have funding and now they're duking it out in the marketplace and, you know, working with clients and growing the business. Are you there for them in terms of the software development and support?
after that initial period or are you handing the baton back to them and they're building their own team or what are the next steps?
Ali Hafizji (22:14.862)
We've seen both things happen. mean, the of the matter is we don't know when a company is going to get BMF. Right. Sometimes it takes just a really long amount of time and you just need to keep iterating and trying to find out what allows you to sort of get a product that is going to be used by 40 percent of your marketable audience. That's when you say that you've reached BMF.
But for the ones that do and the ones that do achieve it fast enough, we've done both. So we've sort of continued working with them, maybe built parallel products, maybe identified a few unique customers that have different needs and built a product just to satisfy that. We've also built a couple of products in completely adjacent markets that help.
drive customers to the core product. We've done a bunch of those endeavors, which is a different service. comes under something that we offer, which is called Amplify. But we've also seen cases where the customer might want to take things in-house and we've handed it over to their in-house team. So we've seen both cases happen where we continue working with them on a sprint by sprint basis. And if they choose to, might also hand over the baton to somebody internally.
Michael Bernzweig (23:35.81)
Makes a lot of sense. And yeah, I mean, there are so many different phases and needs and depending upon the maturity of the organization and where they are in the market and where the market is. So obviously it's not a one size fits all by any stretch of the imagination. Now, a big portion other than the technical.
Ali Hafizji (23:59.544)
Mm-hmm.
Michael Bernzweig (23:59.795)
aspects of the solution is the go-to-market strategy in terms of marketing and zeroing in on the clients that can use the solution and growing the number of clients. Are you helping out on that end of it as well or is that a totally separate function for a CMO?
Ali Hafizji (24:24.878)
I think so. think it's a complete different function for a CMO. What we do is just sort of help them identify, you know, through our experience what we've seen work for a company doing something similar. So if it's a B2B product in, let's say, a FinTech industry or a health tech industry, if we've seen something work, we will sort of consult with them saying that,
Every startup has got limited amount of resources. You can't spread yourself across like five different channels and see what works. Sometimes you just don't have that privilege. So knowing what to do is extremely important. So we'll just sort of consult with them saying that, we've seen this work, you should just focus on this channel. But somebody else needs to come in and sort of really implement different strategies there. Maybe it's a content led strategy or an ad led strategy or a computer community led strategy or a partner led strategy.
or an event led strategy. There's just so much, so many things that one can do. And to implement that itself is quite a monumental task. So I think this is something that mostly we advise the founders to do because that's what they need to really focus all their energy in. But yeah, we can, we consult there. We don't really actually make it happen.
Michael Bernzweig (25:42.848)
Makes a lot of sense. And, you know, I like the fact that you're sticking to your hardcore area of expertise. And I think that that's important. I've always found over the years that, you know, having a subject matter expert that is just that, an expert in their area of subject matter expertise is the best way to move forward. And it's interesting in the very, very early years of Software Oasis back in
1998 is as you can tell from the name, we actually started as a software business. in the early years, one of the solutions that we provided was for, you know, organizations that had a network and an IT person managing a network and people coming and going, we provided and the go-to-market was a one-click solution for
Ali Hafizji (26:13.55)
Mm-hmm.
Michael Bernzweig (26:40.27)
downloading, licensing, and deploying software. And in the 90s, that was absolutely unique and different. And yeah, and obviously things have become, you know, SaaS and people log into whatever their solution is. But one of the things that we did very early on was we actually had our own series of software titles that we produced.
Ali Hafizji (26:43.694)
Mm-hmm.
Ali Hafizji (26:49.749)
game changer.
Michael Bernzweig (27:07.486)
and sold directly to the different organizations. And every single title that we had in the early lineup was single use, single function, focused on a very specific need. And I think that it served everyone best. mean, from our end of it, it was a very tightly defined product.
Ali Hafizji (27:21.998)
See you then.
Michael Bernzweig (27:29.518)
for the users of the solution, was exactly what they needed, nothing more, nothing less. And I think that makes a lot of sense. So I think we're aligned in that area. We always like to leave listeners with some actionable ideas and tips and things like that. But before we get there, is there anything specific that you see founders when they first come to you, do you see the same types of
Ali Hafizji (27:35.928)
BOOM
Michael Bernzweig (27:59.872)
mistakes or challenges or opportunities over and over again that you see showing up on your doorstep.
Ali Hafizji (28:09.456)
yeah, that's a good one. So I see a few common sort of patterns or things that founders talk about. Typically at MVP, there's a lot of vanity metrics being thrown around. So for example, a founder may talk about the amount of traffic that's on their website, the number of PR mentions, the number of signups that are happening, or let's say the round of funding that they've raised, et cetera.
And none of these things actually matter to the health of the business. They're just vanity metrics because what matters at the end is the number of paying customers that you have that are going to stick with you. And I think that's a huge red flag for me because whenever we start, it starts with founders coming to us with many vanity metrics and talking about how they've just figured it out, but they haven't. They've just got it.
to work with a small group of people and most likely it's the people that they already know. And so raising that early round of funding adds fuel to the fire, as you may imagine. But I see that happen a lot. think it's something that's common across all the customers that we've worked with.
Michael Bernzweig (29:25.934)
Got it. And that's interesting because, I think sometimes you sit at a very unique, from, look at things from a very unique vantage point, having worked with so many organizations and obviously every day you hear different opportunities where you can lend a hand. And on the flip side of it, do you have some bullet points that you can leave with founders that may be listening to this episode on
how they know if they're ready for that next step to work with an organization like yours.
Ali Hafizji (30:05.23)
I think the key.
So I think for me, what's most important if you're a founder and...
you are not really moving the metric. If your growth metrics or business metrics are not moving, my guess is that you need to change what you are doing.
You are probably too involved. You're probably doing everything yourself. And you need to probably get a capable team in-house or work with somebody and know how to evaluate them well to help out. So I think the sort of the way to diagnose if a founder needs help is to actually see if the business metrics are moving.
Michael Bernzweig (30:54.55)
in
Ali Hafizji (30:58.718)
If they have a proven idea, but things are not moving, they're probably doing something wrong. They need to change. I also think that founders need to also identify that they are at a turning point. So raising a small seed round of money or having some kind of MVP is a developmental stage. And you need to start doing things differently if you want to grow. And I think every smart founder wants to grow.
So, and some other litmus tests, right? Like if you don't know what is the one feature that will, let's say, get people to refer you a lot, or what's the one feature that will make your product extremely viral if it's a B2C product. If you don't have this kind of user insight, you need to stop doing things differently and go find it. And you'll realize that when you start doing that, you need help to design the product.
That's when you'll need to figure out who to work with or who to hire or how to hire. And that's when you'll start really growing. You need to have answers to these questions because that's what your investors will ask you. What's the insight that you know that others don't know? And you need to go out there and find out what that insight is and ask yourself different questions and thereby your role will automatically change.
Michael Bernzweig (32:20.374)
I love it. And I know we've covered a lot of ground in this episode, but one final question for you. Over the time that you've been doing this, which sounds like it's been some time leading up to this business and then quite a bit of your career prior to this business. Do you have a favorite journey with a founder that just sticks out in your mind where maybe they came to you in
Ali Hafizji (32:35.405)
Mm-hmm.
Michael Bernzweig (32:48.66)
one specific area in their journey and you help them achieve something that either you or they thought was impossible and had an ending that was either exciting or not so exciting, know, good or bad or indifferent, just a story that resonates and sticks with you that you'd like to share.
Ali Hafizji (33:11.722)
Yeah, I mean, I love this question because I think there's so many of these great experiences that we've had. A recent one that I would love to talk about is, we started working with a founder who was working with another agency. We don't know them. And that experience was very eye opening for me because it like just working with us allowed him to actually grow his business from
you know, zero dollars, MRR to at least $25,000 month on month recurring revenue. And the reason why he kept, you know, he was able to do that was because suddenly he was working with a team who was able to sort of work on objectives or metrics and figure out what to do along with him and build it out versus what was happening before was he was actually
working with this team and telling them exactly what to do, how to do it, probably even doing some of the initial designs and prototypes, et cetera. And he never really had the time to figure out, you know, how do I get this in front of the customers that I already know? How do I get them to monetize? And it was a B2B product. So the ticket size was high. So he really needed to do all of the, all of those demos and in-person meetings, et cetera, to lead to a conversion. But I think that was a very good experience for me that sort of
really showed me that this does work. Ultimately, what matters is the bottom line. And if it allows the founder to actually increase that number, then you've delivered what you promised.
Michael Bernzweig (34:50.442)
I love it. love it. Well, I think this is a great episode. I think we really covered a wide range of topics and topics that are meaningful to SaaS founders that are either early or a little bit later in their journey in trying to figure out all the details. Because the one thing for sure is there is no black and white roadmap to the right way to succeed. And it is just that it is a
and finding the straightest path is obviously the best, having some guides along the way is what it's all about. So for anybody that's tuning in this week for the first time, aside from consulting Spotlight, there are two sister episodes, two sister podcasts. There's also the software Spotlight, which is...
Ali Hafizji (35:31.619)
Yeah.
Michael Bernzweig (35:46.616)
the very original podcast in the family. And then our newest podcast, which is Career Spotlight. And Career Spotlight is actually the fastest growing out of the three podcasts, but they're all very unique in the B2B space and serve different audiences. So if you're looking to keep up with all of the podcasts, just...
like or subscribe or whatever it is that you do on your favorite podcast player. And if you want to keep up with everything that's going on over here at Software Oasis, go to softwareoasis.com backslash subscribe and you'll receive updates each week with a lot of the research studies and trends and interviews from the previous week. And hopefully there's some actionable insights and learning for everybody each week. So.
Once again, I really appreciate the time Ali. This week we've had Ali Hafizji with Wednesday Solutions and thank you for your time.
Ali Hafizji (36:53.24)
Thanks for having me. I'll just sort of leave a note. So in case anyone wants to reach out, you can find me on LinkedIn. I'm Ali Hafizji. Yeah, bye.
Michael Bernzweig (37:02.936)
Okay. yeah, and we'll leave a link in the show notes for anybody so people can reach out directly, but absolutely.
Ali Hafizji (37:12.76)
Thanks so much. Thanks, Michael.
Michael Bernzweig (37:15.011)
You're welcome.
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